The Graduation Project is now off the table for Wake County high school students.
Last month, the Wake school board agreed not to go ahead with a separate district Graduation Project. Instead, board members told staff to make sure that the elements of the Graduation Project, such as the research requirement, are embedded elsewhere in the curriculum.
Some Wake high school students had gotten nervous after the school board began talking about making the Graduation Project a local requirement once it was dropped as a state requirement.
For now, the Graduation Project can't be made a statewide requirement before the Class of 2015. Individual districts can move ahead on their own.
Back in April, the Wake school board agreed not to make the Graduation Project a requirement for the Class of 2010. But board members talked then about putting students on notice that they should expect it for the Class of 2011.
In June, the tone shifted when board members agreed not to recommend making the Graduation Project a requirement for the Class of 2011 because of the cost of implementation. The delay for the Class of 2011 and beyond became official last month.
Comments
I am so glad!!!
Fri, 08/14/2009 - 13:27 — momof2goodboysThank Goodness someone came to their senses and dropped this stupid idea! I agree, just make sure all the students know what they need to know for life, and if college is in their future, they will take what is needed to get there. Not everyone plans to go to college. I'd rather have them graduate than quit.
Wouldn't it be great.....
Tue, 08/11/2009 - 20:41 — WuptdoGlad to see another bad idea kicked to the curb. I think a majority of folks would be happy to see kids actually graduate from High School, even if they only able to read/write on the 9th grade level.
Thank you NEA, Federal Gov't and edu-Rats for lowing the bar so everyone get a gold star!
Thanks
Tue, 08/11/2009 - 19:28 — mommy59Glad to hear NO graduation project!
Glad to hear about NO Graduation Project.
Now for the news if you have a recent high school graduate.My daughter just graduated on Jun e12 and due to cutbacks at Wake Tech and the economy the classes are full.She has done everything to try to get a class in what she wants to take but just can't unless I guess we bribe somebody which we won't.
So the new term for her and a few of her friends is now Dsplaced High School Graduate.
I've smelled this before
Tue, 08/11/2009 - 16:17 — klanders65As a teacher, it seemed like so many other things I've seen over the years. The logistics of getting this done and having them graded just seemed impossible. I knew this would go away. It has the characteristics of so many things I've seen in the last 20 years. My own kids were worried about it, and I didn't want to tell them there was no way this would ever actually be a requirement although it is what I thought. Think about it.
And, why is research a requirement for high school graduation?
Graduation
Tue, 08/11/2009 - 16:26 — RichardAndersonAnd, why is research a requirement for high school graduation?
Simple. Because we have been lead to believe that if high school doesn't prepare kids for college, then it is a failure. Te validity of this stance has never been seriously questioned. We look at rate of going on to college as an indicator of the school's worth.
Prepare for college
Tue, 08/11/2009 - 23:12 — klanders65Why not actually prepare them for college then instead of having things like this to make it look like we care about preparing them for college? What percent of NC freshmen have to take remedial math because we graduate kids who can't do intro-level math in college? They have to take "not for credit" college algebra that is essentially 8th grade algebra. Why not prepare them with the math they need for college if we care about them being college ready? When we are not even doing the basics, why would we have this grand plan to go way beyond the basics? I guess maybe that would make people assume we had the basics covered or something. But, they couldn't actually do it, so it doesn't matter what motivated it. We would have had kids who can't write to do algebra but we could say they can do research projects.
Let the colleges teach research projects. We should prepare them with the skills so they can learn when they get to college. Everyone should do what they are supposed to do instead of skipping what they are supposed to do and pretending to aspire to do what the next level is supposed to do.
I know, I am always wanting things to make sense. That is my problem.
So...
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 09:49 — supportwcpssLet me get this straight. You are indicating we shouldn't teach high school kids how to do research???
I'm not understanding this stream of discussion at all except as a mechanism to poke holes for the sake of it.
Clarify
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 20:56 — klanders65Let me clarify.
I am indicating that we should not "teach" kids (I am not sure how formal the teaching was going to be) to do research before we prepare them to pass required basic math and English courses. It would be great if we taught kids to do research. But, most teachers don't know how. That isn't part of undergraduate degrees. And, we are not preparing kids for what we know they need in college. Lets start there.
I'd love to teach them all calculus and physics. But not when they don't know algebra. First things first.
This looked to me like setting a goal we know we cannot achieve so that it looked like we had high expectations, but it is fine not to make it. It would look really bad if we had a goal of teaching all the kids algebra, then decided we just wouldn't do that, and we'd send them to college to learn algebra in remedial classes. That would make us look bad. There are no remedial research courses that our students are having to take when they get to college.
We said
Thu, 08/13/2009 - 08:24 — RichardAndersonThis looked to me like setting a goal we know we cannot achieve so that it looked like we had high expectations,
Well said and right to the point. It is all about appearances.
It seemed clear to me
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 11:15 — TrailerParkGirlYou have to walk before you can run. High schools should be making sure they are teaching students all the walking skills they will need in college before requiring them to do a running project.
Is a "graduation project" the only way high school kids can learn how to do research? Don't think so.
Why do they have to make things so complicated here - mentors, project journals? Here's the KISS method, you take a few days out of some required English course and you teach them "here's how you write a research paper" and you pick a required course (preferably a social science course as they lend themselves well for a research project) take a few days of that class and teach the kiddies how to do research and let them do a research project for that class. Done. For that matter, why are we waiting to teach research skills until the end of HS? I did my first research paper in 5th grade and more in 8th, 10th, 11th and 12th.
Unless there are colleges out their that require huge research projects of freshman, I would guess that before they get to the level of projects requiring mentors in college (usually a "Senior" project), they will have had further opportunities to hone their research skills on smaller projects in lower level college courses.
"I'm not understanding this ... at all"
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 10:33 — g88ky07No surprise there!
Well...
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 10:29 — Bob_SconceThere are really three alternatives:
1. High Schools MUST ALWAYS teach kids how to do research
2. High Schools MUST NEVER teach kids how to do research
3. High Schools MAY teach at least some kids how to do research
#2 is clearly absurd. The real question is whether it should be mandatory (#1) or not (#3).
The concern is that "doing research" is a skill that some high school graduates (especially those not bound for college) will never need, and adding it to the curriculum just adds an unnecessary barrier to those students getting a high school diploma.
Unfortunately, "doing research" isn't some general skill that can be taught in a single class. It's the ability to synthesize a bunch of information into a working theory about how things are (or were). (What Feynmann called "the Pleasure of finding things out".) And, teaching that has to start in 1st grade and go all the way through college.
I guess
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 12:38 — supportwcpssWe have different definitions of research. First, I was not referring to the project which I don't agree with but the general concept of research. I think the skills necessary for this topic can apply across any occupation and should be 'required'.
Yeah..
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 14:06 — Bob_SconceWhat skills are you referring to?
The varying definition is part of the problem. To a nuclear physicist, research may involve looking at existing data to develop a hypothesis about how a proton is constituted, then devising experiments to support or disprove that hypothesis. To an attorney, research involves going into a bunch of law books and trying to figure out what rules apply to a particular problem.
I agree that critical thinking should be taught in public school, and that should start very early. But, beyond that, research skills depend heavily on the field of study.
OK, if you say so
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 13:00 — RichardAndersonI think the skills necessary for this topic can apply across any occupation and should be 'required'.
OK, so how would you structure a research project for someone who has taken mostly vo-tech classes in high school (such that they exist) and is planning on going to Wake Tech to become a certified welder, with the aim of working in the Harris plant in New Hill?
FYI, welding certified for nuclear use is about the pinnacle of industrial welding, as far as I know. This is not an easy career path for anyone, I am just curious how a research project that is required for high school graduation will help someone on this path.
It is a question of priorities
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 10:18 — RichardAndersonYou are indicating we shouldn't teach high school kids how to do research???
No, that is not what I am indicating. What I am indicating is that the ability to do research is not a fundamental skill required by all high school kids. Those that don't go on to college most likely will never need it, some that do to college will not, and those that do need it will have the opportunity to learn it there in most cases. This isn't to say that there should be no research in high school, it is just a question of priorities. Are we at the point where we feel like all high school graduates have sufficient command of all other subjects that we should devote more time to a research project? And do we feel that it would be a benefit to enough of them to make it mandatory for all?
I do support a research project, but it should be elective for those whom it will serve as their continue in life. Requiring it of all students seems silly. Would we require that all students can weld 4130 chrome-moly to AWS specs? No, because not everyone needs to do that. So why require a research project of kid who is going to graduate high school, go on to study welding so he can be a certified welder in a nuclear plant?
We need to stop trying to fit kids into a mold. Not all kids are going on to college for liberal arts majors and then related professions. I know that is hard for people who studied education to understand sometimes (I am one of them, so I know) but this whole research project is just another example of making kids fit the lessons rather than the lessons fit the kids.
Well said
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 11:22 — TrailerParkGirl"We need to stop trying to fit kids into a mold....this whole research project is just another example of making kids fit the lessons rather than the lessons fit the kids."
Well said.
True
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 09:07 — lferreriHaving taught college students for many years, I know that they often lack basic skills. I have found that many students, for example, do not know how to convert percentages to decimals. In my field, you have to do that frequently, so I end up teaching them myself. It isn't just math. Often they do not know basic grammar and spelling. One of the history professors I know says that many students do not know basic historical facts. I do not think this is because they are incapable of learning. My experience has been that, once I teach them the basic concepts, they are able to use them. They just don't seem to have been taught.
I read the summary of the graduation project on the WCPSS web site. Some parts of it don't sound anything like the kind of work required in college, at least in colleges where I have taught. I can't imagine a college requiring a student to find a mentor. I'm not sure what a "tangible product" is either, but it doesn't sound like anything I have ever seen required at a college. Neither does the "portfolio containing your reflective writings or logs..".
Basic skills
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 20:30 — klanders65This is what I was saying. Some huge percentage of our high school graduates have to take remedial math classes when they go to college, and they can't write papers. Lets get them these skills. And these skills--being able to convert decimals to fractions and write clear sentences---would serve them well whether they go to collge or not. I think the graduation project was a way to make it look like we were doing something to prepare kids because we don't want to or can't do what would really prepare them--teach them basic skills. I agree with iferreri. The kids are teachable.
I was dreading being a mentor to heavens knows how many kids. Find a mentor? Anything with a portfolio of reflective writings is usually going to die before it happens. I have noticed this over the 20+ years I've been in education. It is a rule of thumb. If there is a portfolio of reflective writing, it is going to fizzle out.
You know the answer
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 08:27 — RichardAndersonCome on, you know the answer. It is all about appearances. To be able to say "these kids are ahead of the game they have done a research project" helps hide the fact that nearly one in five isn't graduating and, as you pointed out, many of them aren't ready for college when they arrive.
Wanting things to make sense
Wed, 08/12/2009 - 00:08 — TrailerParkGirlIt is not just your problem. It is a common affliction here in opposite world.
Now Could PLC Be Dropped?
Tue, 08/11/2009 - 14:50 — RMC10I always thought after reading about this project that it just might push some over the edge and actually increase the drop out rate further.
Now what about PLC!
RMC, I certainly hope
Tue, 08/11/2009 - 17:02 — dryeraseuserRMC, I certainly hope so!!! I certainly hope so!! Another useless initiative...it has "good qualities" and a good philosophy behind it, BUT it will never return the results that Del & Co. are shoving into the faces of teachers, students and parents. We will just have to keep our fingers crossed and faith that it will.
Come again with this... do
Tue, 08/11/2009 - 14:30 — rr77rr99Come again with this... do HS Students who are currently IN HIGH SCHOOL have to do this project? I remain confused? Are individual WC high school's going to make kids do it anyway? For whatever reason.
The schools are looking at what a $21 million budget cut for next year? Yeah, these schools are lucky if they even have teachers next year.
Insane.
It's dead. If an individual
Tue, 08/11/2009 - 16:30 — KeungHui (author)It's dead. If an individual Wake high school wanted to do on its own that's possible but unlikely.
Some high schools have a somewhat equivalent project that's not affected. There are the 10th -rade projects at the IB schools and the Senior Project at Southeast Raleigh High.
Are you Sure
Tue, 08/11/2009 - 14:16 — mommy59You might think I am idiot for asking.2 weeks ago at Cougar Camp (WFRHS) this was announced then last week the school came out with an email about saying the project is not being done for the class of 2010 ands 2011 .So I guess somebody got smart and oushed it even further from the class of 2013.Nobody is pulling my leg this time!
My son is happy he won't have to do it.