Ever thought of reassignment as being a terrorist act?
You might want to read this e-mail message that was sent to the school board. It's written by a Preston resident who is upset about the proposed reassignment of students from Green Hope High to Cary High and from West Cary Middle to East Cary Middle.
Headline: PRESTON COMMUNITY ROCKED BY MAJOR "BLAST"
Cary, NC Nov. 30, 2008 — A large area in the interior of the established Preston community known as node 657.1, was devastated by a "bombshell" delivered by the Growth and Student Assignment committee, a "splinter group" of the Wake County School board. The senseless, "terrorist-like act" seeks to sever hundreds of students from their local community school ties at Green Hope (for example) and send them on a needless, longer journey for education. There is also potential significant collateral damage reported by nearby residents who don't even have children. The group did not claim responsibility at first, but they did post the horrifying details on their web site, hoping that no one would notice. This is the same group that has "terrorized" residents of many Wake County communities with similar tactics during the past 5 years. The "attacks" have been wide-spread and are becoming more numerous, leading some to speculate the organization is out of touch, out of control and desperate.
The "attack" on the Preston community was definitely not a random act. It appears to have been designed to destroy the integrity and fragment this established community. It is not clear what the motivation was that lead to the "attack." Some theorize it may be to "cover-up" questionable decisions to invest and add capacity in schools like Cary HS where growth was not an issue, (apparently there is considerable excess capacity as a result), rather than focus on areas where there was some real growth. Others suggest it may be a misguided way to remedy basic shortcomings in the quality of education being delivered at some schools. In essence, schools that have demonstrated an ability to excel academically overall are being arbitrarily gerrymandered through a senseless, artificial, costly exchange of students. Get the point... and meanwhile.
What is a node? There is something cold and impersonal about the term, node, even if it has a number. Here is what the dictionary says:
. noun technical 1 a point in a network at which lines intersect or branch. 2 a computer or other device attached to a network. 3 Botany the part of a plant stem from which one or more leaves emerge. 4 Anatomy a small mass of distinct tissue. 5 Physics & Mathematics a point at which the amplitude of vibration of a wave is zero.
Nowhere does it mention people. There are real people involved here that would be adversely affected; this is not some inanimate bunch of objects to play around with and manipulate like a computer game. Accordingly, you are urged to include nodes 657.1 and 657.2 in the reassignment plan as assigned to Green Hope High School, and 100% voluntary year round for East Cary Middle School and Morrisville Elementary School for the school years 2009-12, to recognize the critical contribution that the Green Hope community provides to the formative development of the young future adults in nodes 657.1 and 657.2, to avoid the potential of reassigning these nodes in the near future to balance the populations of high schools and year round middle schools to new schools planned for west Wake County, to observe the commitment to the year round calendar on a voluntary basis and to support the families of nodes 657.1 and 657.2 by keeping their neighborhood together and by allowing them to keep their students enrolled at Green Hope High School and to voluntarily enroll in schools with year round schedules.
Regards,
Peter Eckle
(I'm omitting his address, which was included in his message.)
Comments
what *I* am sad for is the
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 18:14 — AngelaWwhat *I* am sad for is the families torn apart by split schedules due to MYR wreaked upon us by a school system "gone wild" over ideals that are not working instead of focusing on education not dilution and reassignments based on faulty numbers.
Where do you stand? - ncdad1
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 18:43 — Voice_of_Reason_Your views are so all over the place they are hard to figure out. Like the school system hate. Love it for some reasons, hate it for the same. Love diversity, hate the bad effects. I can tell you one thing though, diversity and MYR took a good school and ruined it, the school is the same one he is talking about, Wakefield Elementary. The base population are moving to private every day.
let them go
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 19:49 — ncdad1That may be your problem trying to pigeon hole people in to boxes and trying to find the one right answer to complex problems. Let those folks go that don't want to be here ...If we could shed some more people to private schools we could prevent all this reassignment and building programs.
That method is just as bad.
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 05:41 — vsheehanThat method is just as bad. Your solving the problem by punishing those who can sacrifice or afford a private tuition. You do not solve a problem by punishing others. If we were to follow you’re your thought pattern it would be OK to exclude kids who need extra support as it takes money away from the rest of the student body. Hey just get rid of the AG kids who need differential learning because they sap money from the general population. I believe the solution can come with out unduly burdening others.
Not punishment
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 08:11 — ncdad1I don't think of it as punishment but opportunity. Many of my friends pay much more per year for their kids to be in CASL Premier? thinking the extras will get their kid a soccer scholarship. I see the same investment in music, dance, etc. where people don't feel the schools are excelling. I don't see them complaining that the High School soccer programs sucks or trying to manipulate the nodes to get all the good soccer players into their school. At a few thousand a year for property tax (I think, school is 50-75% of property tax) a person could be more cost effective investing in two to three hours of private tutoring after school to pick up what the government issue program did not cover.
Compulsory versus elective
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 09:28 — Dadof3Try reforming your analogies. Public education (i.e., required attendence either state or private) and the tax revenue that supports is compulsory. Your examples are elective. I presume you understand the difference?
compare
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 09:48 — ncdad1Common on ... your property tax is $4000 and the school takes 33% local funding (maybe you could include the State and federal portion which others pay for us) so you pay $1,300 for all your kids. Most people spend more on vacations in a year. Is $10-$30k/yr for private school worth the difference?
http://www.wcpss.net/budget/2006-07-bpss/
Ummm...
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 10:42 — Dadof3I don't understand the context for your point and I question your numbers -- but that's all a red herring here.
I asked, do you understand the difference between a compulsory tax and an elective rate for services and why I ask the question?
Political ramifications of "letting them go"
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 06:59 — Dadof3There's many reasons why people leave the system. NCDad1 wanted better language arts skills for his children, some want religious ed, others want to focus on their children's specific ability, and I'd wager that very few do so to xenophobically cloister their family. (And, as a free nation -- have at it. Save us from the control freaks.) However, as the exodus as a percentage increases, there's less public school client families who have a vested or direct interest in public ed. With our decreasing birth rates, expect less taxpayers with children or grandchildren in the system.
The question will inevitably become more common than it is today: "Why should I pay money into a system from which I receive no direct benefit?" There are many good answers but to those asking, they've already set up a higher bar for making a convincing rebuttal.
I hear this question more frequently -- and with a BoE(eR) & WCPSS that is antagonistic towards its clients, and client families increasingly chafed by unproven methods -- expect this grand social experiment to collapse with serious consequences for public education in general.
My answer is...
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 09:20 — Bob_SconceOften, that question comes from senior citizens. Here are my favorite two answers:
(1) "That's exactly how I feel about social security. How about we trade -- you pay my social security taxes, and I'll pay your property taxes?"
(2) "Who paid for you and your kids to go to school?"
I have some of my own responses, too...
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 09:37 — Dadof3I consider you one of the most persuasive people here, but the point is lost on people who are not vested enough to care, (or there's just too much good TV to really engage) regardless of one's answer. I know a more than a few middle-aged childless couples that ask that question, often sheepishly. The sheepishness will fade at our current rate.
That's my point.
Paying into the pot
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 09:55 — ncdad1I just always thought that we pay into a pot for police, an army, roads, sewers, drinking water, schools, etc. and we get a "society" out the other side. I just never thought that since I don't drive on that road, I should not pay for it or since my neighborhood is safe I should not pay for police. We migh argue on the amount or what we are getting compared to Orange Co. but I never thought of my taxes line item by line item and wanting to only pay for the line items that benefited me personally at that point in time.
You've already bought in on the tax front
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 10:36 — Dadof3It's the "average citizen" to which I refer -- I know you're already on board for higher taxes for education. You miss my point.
Common Pattern
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 19:04 — Bob_SconceIts happening throughout the school system. Turner Creek. Davis Drive is next.
Nobody knows the recipe for making a good school. If we did, we'd be making them right-and-left. Instead, they seem to appear when the stars align and you get the right mix of teachers, parents and students. It can continue indefinitely as the pride in the school is contageous. But, once you kill it, boy it's hard to start up again.
Given that, the best approach when one pops up is to LEAVE IT ALONE. The School District just cannot seem to learn that lesson.
what to expect
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 19:35 — ncdad1Bob, your expectations for government are too high. Public schools are structured to create an average citizen who can go to work and fight. It is like building roads, pouring aspalt, putting sewer, schools are just an average service they offer. There is no incentive to excel no matter how much people try to insert the private sector into the public sector... government does not excel ... we just depend on them to build road, lay sewer and fight wars ... any aligning of the stars is accidental in my mind .... every boarded up school in town once had a great PTA, involved parents and thought they had the right formula ... I think Wake Schools are amazing ... lots of class offerings, we always seem to have plenty of scholarship winners, students going to great college, broad array of sport and activitites ... not a bad gig really ... WCPSs schools are not Phillips Exeter or Groton but they are not bad ... I should say I have lived in Atlanta and Washington, DC which are my comparison of public school systems that have many more problems.
Gee that explains some
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 04:29 — vsheehanGee that explains some things. No school system should ever be compared to DC. DC went into receivership and that extreme consequence didn’t fix the problem. The nepotism issues in DC schools have made the situation a unique one and you cannot use them as an example of anything. On the other hand the basic behavior of kids in DC schools is much better then WCPSS most disruptive schools. Funny now that I think about it DC also ,long before their voucher system started, sends special ed kids private. In DC case that was court mandated.
Hmm
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 22:46 — Bob_SconceWell, I have seen school districts which repeatedly do an excellent job on par with many private schools. I agree that Wake County is better than most large-city school districts. But, that's not much of a comparison, because most large-city school districts are terrible. A big part of the problem is the size -- a 100,000 student district is just too much for a school board to manage. As a result, they end up focusing far more on things like building programs than they do on making sure that the right teachers are being hired or that the right educational programs are being offered. Can any WCPSS school board member even name the principals at all the schools, let alone curriculum leaders or inidividual teachers?
The current president of the National School Boards Association comes from a smaller district where every school has won at least one Blue Ribbon award (10 in all), plus a bunch of other awards. The awards stretch back into the '80s, so it's no fluke. (see http://www.uscsd.k12.pa.us/466511521614545/site/default.asp )
That is possible for Wake County. But, it means some structural change which can't be done with the current leadership and its blind following of failed policies.
One large city school system
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 04:58 — vsheehanOne large city school system that you should take note of is Seattle. They improved their school systems so much that there are no private schools in the city anymore. What they did corresponds with the idea that small communities are better. Instead of each school having one principal, staff and 1000s of kids they broke it up with in the building. Each school has 2-4 small schools with separate staff and principals and students.
That one building will have
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 07:30 — gwaihirThat one building will have house 4 separate communities within the building.
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I think South Granville High School does this as well. And I think that they changed to do this not so long ago. I remember looking at the website once when it looked like a normal high school, and then later on I was looking at it again and seeing details of 4 separate schools-within-a-school. You apply to the one that you want. It seems like a very good idea to me.
Let me use an example
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 13:02 — Voice_of_Reason_Say you are in charge of a platoon in battle. Everyone got his basic ration of bullets. Two of your soldiers, despite his training was still unable to shot well, was undisciplined, and often shot without aiming, but he was part of the unit. Another two were disciplined, and good shots; they made the best of training that was given to them. You were running low on bullets and got a resupply, the battle was getting fierce. You are in charge, do you hand out the bullets equally? Remember, I never mentioned color or ethniticity here only character and ability. All men had the same access to training and re-training.
What would happen if you did?
Would you have a better outcome if the sharpshooter got more?
What would be better for the common good?
PLEASE -cDon't try to equate this to schools or diversity, I am making a point about spreading the wealth around.
“A society is only as good
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 05:24 — vsheehan“A society is only as good as they treat their weakest member.” One thing I have heard from recent immigrants from countries with a school system based off of the British system is the US of A has more ways for a kid to succeed. There is no one chance and you lose. Even the SAT is not a death sentence. Do bad on the test go to a community college work hard and you can transfer into a better college in two years. You end up with a better society when you realize there is more than one way to skin a cat. USA is called the educational system of second chances because if you do not succeed at first you are not blocked from trying again. I would rather have someone who has fallen and gotten up and tried again running a company then someone who because of genetics, family wealth, family stability, and hard work got through no problem. The person who has fallen knows how to weather bad times the person who has never fallen has never been truly tested.
Second chances
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 08:33 — ncdad1"USA is called the educational system of second chances because if you do not succeed at first you are not blocked from trying again"
That is an active choice we make as Americans since determination and second chances seem to be part of our culture. Note, the Korean, Indian, or Japnaese system might be more effecient but we choose not to be effecient which is ok. When in Japan, I saw a news article where older people and homeless are left to starve when they run out of resources since their failure is embarrassing. That is an effecient use of resources like Voice would support. The most startling thing for me was my High School reunion where the riches and most sucessful folks where not from he "honors" program like me nor had attended college but instead had become builders, built a plumbing company, owned a few restraunts, and ran a trucking company. I had naively writen them off because they were not in the Advanced classes, did poorly on their SAT and never went to college. Life teaches you interesting lessons.
The most startling thing
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 10:31 — NWRaleighMomThe most startling thing for me was my High School reunion where the riches and most sucessful folks where not from he "honors" program like me nor had attended college but instead had become builders, built a plumbing company, owned a few restraunts, and ran a trucking company.
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People have different definitions of success. I have tremendous respect for entrepreneurs, especially for those who built business themselves. But I would prefer my children to take a different path even if they earn much less money. Problem is, just 2-3 hours of tutoring in addition to mediocre HS, as you earlier suggested, won't be sufficient to get them to MIT, Caltech or similar top engineering school. They must work hard, but they also must have advanced AP courses to be able to get in to the school of their choice.
But I would prefer my
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 18:05 — gwaihirBut I would prefer my children to take a different path even if they earn much less money.
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Depends more on their views of their future careers, than yours.
True, but there is still
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 21:46 — NWRaleighMomTrue, but there is still hope that they will share my views.
Ok, here is my take ... is
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 11:13 — ncdad1Ok, here is my take ... is your kid getting their potential?
First step, Average HS+tutoring
Second, Homeschooling
Third, Private School
Fourth, Move to a better place
If your kid is MIT material (400 kids accepted each year from the world) and they are not getting their potential filled, by all means make that happen.
I went to GA Tech worked my way through college coming out with $20,000 in the bank while the women I started my first day of work came from Princeton had $80,000 of debt! We probably started at the same salary. I just could not see the $100k difference was worthwhile. I went on to get my MBA at Dartmouth at company expense.
I think using up all your resources and time on some of these select school, at least for undergraduate work, may not be a good investment. I think the greater payback comes from paying a premium for graduate studies personally.
Please provide references for your numbers
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 13:01 — Dadof3Otherwise, I'll think of Steven Wright's joke: "82.3% of all statistics are made up."
You can not use Google too?
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 13:47 — ncdad1http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/massachusetts-institute-technology/171582-mit-acceptance-rate.html
Apparently we both can't "not google"
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 15:14 — Dadof3http://web.mit.edu/ir/cds/2005/c.htm (for 2004)l
you are right
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 16:35 — ncdad1Sorry you are right .. I stand corrected .. still, moving out of the county to try to get your kid to be one of 1500 seems drastic.
Ehhh.
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 12:56 — Bob_SconceThe value of the top-name schools depends largely on what you want to do. For example, it's much easier to get into graduate programs from top-tier schools than it is to get in from mediocre schools. Similarly, you're much more likely to work for, say, Google if your degree is from MIT, Cal Tech or Carnegie Mellon than if it's from (no offense) Georgia Tech. While the top kids at lower-tier schools will still do well, most kids at top-tier schools will do well.
It depends on your major -- if you're going to major in, say, English and will not go to graduate school, then you should do it as cheap as you can, because there are very few jobs for English Majors that will pay enough to justify massive debt.
MIT admits about 1500 students every year. ~90% from the US and ~2/3ds from public schools. I suspect that if any of those kids came from WCPSS, they came from Enloe.
http://www.mitadmissions.org/topics/pulse/incoming_freshman_class_profile/
For example, it's much
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 22:10 — NWRaleighMomFor example, it's much easier to get into graduate programs from top-tier schools than it is to get in from mediocre schools.
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Yes, this is absolutely true if kid chooses math major.
Cary Academy
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 14:49 — ncdad1I was looking at CA a few year back when my kids were in Middle School but I was a little surprised at how few kids went on to MIT, etc. The students win a lot of awards, travel overseas in the summer and look like they have a lot of fun though. It seems many prefer UNC from the notices in the paper. Many chose the local state schools like State, UNC-G/W or Western? I would have thought for 4x$20k=$80k of education you would have a direct pass to the top schools.
At that rate
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 15:41 — Dadof3the parents ran out of money...
I would think the NC
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 13:56 — ncdad1I would think the NC student going to MIT come from NC School of Math and Science in Durham http://www.ncssm.edu/about-ncssm/facts.php
Your fourth option is the
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 12:24 — NWRaleighMomYour fourth option is the only alternative.
This is sad when moving out of the system is the only way to allow kids to achieve their best. We moved to this county fooled by high test scores and promise of good schools, as many others.
AG kids are not the only ones who failed by this system.
It is funny how Wake constantly gets compared to DC, Atlanta and other places with totally different demographics. But my recently moved coworked is complaining that her Special Ed kid was getting better services in Detroit (of all places)! What was the main reason for her moving out of there? Right - The award-winning Wake County Public School System!
I agree with most of what you said vsheehan ; But...
Thu, 12/04/2008 - 07:31 — Voice_of_Reason_If you carried out the example to the end, let me show you what would probably happen:
1. Equal bullets given to all. Then we get less bullets on target and a higher chance of failure. You would get a morale problem (short lived) because the sharpshooters would not be able to accomplish their potential, I the battle continues all would die, nobody wins.
2. Sharpshooter given more. Better chance of success. Weaker members are freed up to do tasks that assist the sharpshooters (targeting, resupply, etc,). All might live. The team adapted.
Remember all were trained and given an opportunity for re-training. Some just don't "cut the mustard" whatever you do to help them, some of these men probably did bad at the beginning and keep trying and got better, and some were naturals at it. That's what happens in real life. In real life when the "S#*t hits the fan, as you say, those with poor training usually fall apart and get pushed aside, but they still can assist in support roles. That's from many years of real-life experience, not book learning . I'm an engineer, not a liberal arts major.
bullets
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 13:15 — ncdad1Voice the answer is the bullets go to the best folks since sucess of the mission is the goal.
Many countried do the same thing with their school whereby students are given national tests all along the way to determine if they go to the next level .. if you don't make the grade it is off to Burger King. The Spartens killed any baby that had a defect so it would not pollute the other, and Hitler staked his claim on white Arians. As a society, we make decisions on how to allocate scared resources which reflects the nature of the society. My Japanese and Korea co-workers think US kids are stupid and lazy because they don't have enough homework, take inferior classes and let their kids waste time on cheerleading and soccer.
As I said, 50% of Wake County students are minorities and that number is expected to grow. If these kids are not at the top of their game when they reach adulthood the US will be in sad shape.
50%?
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 16:38 — Bob_SconceSo, first of all, the district busses based on F&R status, not race. Secondly, if the F&R numbers are that high (and, I'd like to see your source), then a big part of the reason would have to be people who have left the school system either for home schooling or private schooling -- IIRC, there are ~28K kids in Wake County educated outside WCPSS. So, the question has to be: Why?
It's a question the district has to answer, because the diversity policy is premised on using affluent suburban parents as a resource. F&R kids are bussed into affluent neighborhoods because they have active PTAs and parents spend a lot of time in the schools and at home educating their kids. If those families leave, then this premise fails. Not only that, but those families start opposing the school system--why support giving more tax money to the public schools when you're subsidizing them by paying the full cost of your own kids?
I think families are leaving largely because of the district's policies: In 2001-02, Wakefield was a "School of Excellence." This year, it's a "School of Progress." In '04-'05, Turner Creek was an Honors School of Excellence; by '06-'07, it had dropped to a "School of Distinction."
These are direct results of the district's constant fiddling with the schools, largely through the diversity, reassignment and calendar policies. These policies are driving away the families that have alternatives. And, that does not bode well for the district.
Answers
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 17:42 — ncdad1"and, I'd like to see your source"
Low income/Limited English
Athens 40%/8%, Cary 39%/11%, Apex 12%/3%, Green Hope 12%/4%, Pather Creek 9%/5%
Cary and Athens are carrying the load.
http://ap2008.wcpss.net/assignment-proposal/schools/368.html?view=profile1
"So, the question has to be: Why?"
Most of the people who homeschooled with us did it for religous reasons. They felt schools were a Godless place with people who would corrupt their kids. I alway thought that Jesus would have probably have been in public school ministering to the needy and not cloistered at home. We Homeschooled because I have seen where girls are directed away from math and science in our society and I did not want that to happend to my girls. While they prefer language arts they are not afraid of math or science now. Plus, I cherish all that time with them each day that public school parents missed out on. Second, I wanted them to be fluent in French and German. The public schools have not really embraced foreign languages to a great extent especially in Elem and MS.
They went back into public schools in middle school and are top students in their public highschool now.
"I think families are leaving largely because ...."
I don't see where enough people have left yet given that there are 500 too many student at Panther's Creek with many of the classes meeting in the hallway.
"These are direct results of the district's constant fiddling with the schools, largely through the diversity, reassignment and calendar policies."
Probably agree ... but I think it is testing and metrics ... the federal and state governments give conflicting direction that local schools boards have to accomidate.
Ok.
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 18:15 — Bob_SconceYour view of homeschoolers is interesting -- we have several friends who homeschool and while there is no one reason, a common thread is that they didn't think the public schools were serving their kids' needs. Your characterization is true sometimes also.
As far as Panther Creek, I don't think that's at odds with my statement--it just means that students are still moving into the county faster than existing students get dissatisfied with the schools. As long as you're pouring water into the bucket fast enough, it doesn't matter how big the leak is.
The Feds and State have always given conflicting directions (yet another reason for the U.S. Dept. of Ed to be disbanded.) So, I'm not sure how that contributes to a steady decline in performance. Some say that we've reset our standards to national levels, but that just means that the district has always been crappy.
WWND?
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 18:06 — Dadof3I alway [sic] thought that Jesus would have probably have been in public school ministering to the needy and not cloistered at home.
That would explain "Fish and Loaves Fridays" at Nazareth High.
As I said, 50% of Wake
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 14:00 — NWRaleighMomAs I said, 50% of Wake County students are minorities and that number is expected to grow. If these kids are not at the top of their game when they reach adulthood the US will be in sad shape.
Some of my coworkers, neighbors, friends are minorities. I expect their kids to be at the top of their game when they grow up. First of all, because these kids have very involved parents. Unfortunately, we can not expect all minorities children to be at the top of their game no matter how much we bus.
President-elect owns his success to his highly educated parents and nurturing environment not to diversity busing.
But if you gave them out equally
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 13:31 — Voice_of_Reason_Failure would probably be the outcome is the answer. I really don't have a problem with the first sentence, I do with all the others. I think your co-workers are on to something. Maybe look at how their kids do, usually better than most American kids. Maybe you need a diversity lesson. If you fail to set goals, you will never achieve them. If you don't ask children to produce, most will not. If you don't have any penalty for not trying and doing the work, the work will never be done.
WCPSS sets goals too high (100% graduation), doesn't push children to try their best (ask an AG parent), and sets few if any penalties for failure to perform. That's the problem, and the solution is not diversity.
ncdad1 is a relic
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 12:29 — shearertwI tried to stay out of this but I can't take it anymore.
The venom ncdad1 spews is ancient history, remnents of a bygone era unfortunately making a comeback with the recent political victories.
Let's be honest, the evil wealthy people ncdad refers to are paying for EVERYTHING. Yes the roads, yes the schools, etc. To suggest we have no say b/c we're "wards of the state" is rediculous. We are the state. Without the tax revenue from the wealthy, there is no state.
I'd love to get out of the "state" sponsered schools. Just give me my tax money back and I'll be gone thank you very much. Not because I don't want my kid sitting next to Johnny F&R but because the schools suck and spending money busing kids around is part of the reason why.
Of course we should "help" the poor, VOR covered that topic.
FYI - the evil wealthy (at lease conservative ones) provide the bulk of charity too!
There IS one racist on the blog today... ncdad1.
schools
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 13:25 — ncdad1We homeschooled our kids through Middle School and they are now in HS. We did it not for religous reasons but so my girls would master multiple languages and excel in math which is not a priority of public school here. Don't wait for a the state to refund your money, act on your convictions now. Be your own man. Until you are your own man, you are tied to what they tell you to do. Government schools are like roads and water lines , just basic, public resources that are "good enough". If an individual wants something more they need to do it themselves (e.g. homeschool / private) or work to improve the system (e.g. stop whining about F&R kids).
Wrong again
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 14:35 — shearertwWe (I) have every right to complain and fight back about the "services" we receive from our government. We are paying for every bit of it and if it is not what we expect or want, we should through the bums out and get new bums. I don't want forced diversity busing because I believe it is an ineffective means to solve a problem. I want my tax dollars to go to neighborhood schools for a variety of reasons you are too closed minded to understand. I have every right to fight for that.
FYI, I am considering home schooling our of desparation to leave the current system. Talk about inequity, how many single moms of an F&R child can homeschool?
First, I think the
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 15:09 — ncdad1First, I think the population explosion in this areas will blow away any carping from a few parents. The tsunami is just too big and kids will be sloshed back and forth for years. Trying to hold on to this elementary school or that middle school will be tiring.
I would like to know more about your opposition to forced diversity busing. From the maps, if you are a white westerner, you don't get bussed downtown. Maybe you get assigned to some other near by school that is a few miles further which is inconvenient. Neighborhood with in a few miles probably look like your neighborhood and the kid probably do to. They probably play soccer together after school. So, I don't see where you are affected greatly. And the F&R kids being bussed in are a small fraction of the total school population and your kids probably won't even come in contact with them since they will be in remedial classes and won't ride your kid's bus.
Note, we did not "leave the system" when we homeschooled. I thought of it more like my kids where in a local magnet program where they met up with their public school friends after school. I am thankful to NC for being so open. Many state really put you through the ringer with visits, tests, forms. It helps that they are thankful for every student that leave a seat open. Again, I believe I am paying taxes for public education not specifically for my kids. I think of these taxes more like what I pay for roads which are a public utility. I pay for more roads than I actually use.
First, let me say thanks for outing yourself
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 16:23 — Voice_of_Reason_The fact you pulled you children out of WCPSS, admits you believe they fail you. Your say in the matter also diminishes because are an outsider, you see only what you want to see, you do not live it. Sure you are a taxpayer (at least I hope you are one) and have a vote.
Your arguments are weak, and full of holes - like WCPSS. It is also interesting to note that your use of English all of a sudden got better when you outed yourself as a home schooler. Hummm, I smelling something......
chill
Wed, 12/03/2008 - 17:57 — ncdad1Boy you seem mad at the world ... take a chill pill ...
We did not pull out of public school ... you make it sound like some movie where you turn your back and walk away. We just homeschooled while the kids were in elementary school so they could get more math, science and language than was offered here. Plus we love to travel and saw the world with them while not being constrained by traditional calendar. I am kind of sad for you that you have to give your kids up to such a big part of the day.