WakeEd

The WakeEd blog is devoted to discussing and answering questions about the major issues facing the Wake County school system. How much will the new Democratic majority on the school board do to undo the changes made by Republicans since 2009? Will the new student assignment plan be a hybrid of the last two models or primarily be a return to the use of busing for diversity? Who will replace Tony Tata as the new superintendent of the state's largest district? How will voters react to a likely request in 2013 to borrow potentially more than $1 billion to build and renovate schools?

WakeEd is maintained by The News & Observer's Wake schools reporter, T. Keung Hui. While Keung posts information and analysis on the issues, keep us posted on your suggestions, questions, tips and what you're doing to cope with the changes in Wake's schools.

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Questioning whether it was a reasoned or rushed decision on assignment plan

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Was Tuesday's adoption of a new Wake County student assignment plan the culmination of years of study and discussion or a rushed decision?

As noted in today's article, school board members and administrators defended the vote as being necessary to avoid delaying implementation of the plan. But critics, particularly during the public comment section, urged the board to hold off adoption until the newly elected members have their say on the plan.

"The voters spoke," said Robert Hyman. "You lost the election. In effect, the chair of this board has been fired. You owe it to the new board to discuss it with them before you completely lose your moral authority and your legitimacy.”

"This board can use its short-term political advantage to do as it pleases, but that means leaving more of a mess for the next board," added Bob Siegel. "If you really want to make a difference, put the politics aside, reach across the aisle and take a closer look at this plan."

David Zonderman said that as a history teacher he had to give his history lesson about how the "narrow board majority staged a parliamentary coup d'etat in 2009" and "dismantled a nationally recognized assignment policy."

Zonderman also took a shot at Superintendent Tony Tata for his insistence that the plan needed to be adopted Tuesday.

"The current narrow majority, now a rump lame duck faction egged on by the superintendent, is tonight trying to ram through a radical change in school assignment policy that remains vague on crucial details such as key feeder patterns and projected school transportation costs," Zonderman said.

Zonderman said he could find no evidence how delaying the plan a year would harm parents and students.

“The demand for an immediate vote is yet another example of poor governance driven by smash mouth sour grapes politics rather than due diligence and thoughtful deliberation," Zonderman said. "Any member of this board, regardless of their political affiliation, who votes tonight to move peremptorily with this new assignment plan is undermining the incoming board members by denying them a role in the decision-making process and saddling them a policy riddled with troubling questions.

This vote is also a slap in the face of thousands of citizens who turned out last week and voted resoundingly for a policy of good governance and careful analysis. I say shame on anyone who disrespects the democratic process and votes to push through this assignment plan tonight.”

Erica Kirschner-Dean complained that the people "who are rushing to have it approved will not be the ones to implement it."

“Why all this rush to vote on this plan?" Kirschner-Dean said. "That’s what I’d like to know. This plan could be a disaster in the making. It could be an absolute nightmare to implement and result in creating more schools of poverty.'

The Rev. Earl Johnson, pastor of Martin Street Baptist Church, accused the school board of “playing political football with our children’s future”

"I don’t understand what the rush is," Johnson said. "Why not hold off on implementing this assignment plan until after the runoff election on Nov. 8th? I’m afraid people see this as a rush to judgment, as a plan that is politically motivated and not student oriented.”

When the plan was presented later in the evening, Tata responded to those who called for a delay.

"We understand and have seen first-hand many times that assignment is an emotional issue," Tata said. "There could hardly be a more divisive issue politically. But this isn’t about politics. This is about parents and the children who are entrusted to our care. And if we delay, it is precisely the parents and children who are the bill payers."

Before later voting no, school board member Kevin Hill had some nice things to say about the plan.

"I think it’s going to be a good plan," Hill said. "I think it will be a plan that moves Wake County forward with some work. But I can’t support that without seat set-asides at the regional high-performance schools.”

Board member Anne McLaurin explained she was voting yes but warned that more money would be needed.

“To make this plan work it will require additional resources and I would hope this board is prepared to ask our county commissioners and the state for the funds that we need to make this a good plan that provides an education for all our students," McLaurin said.

School board member Carolyn Morrison read her statement in support of the plan.

School board member Debra Goldman argued the vote wasn't rushed as she mentioned how she had introduced the Dec. 1, 2009 resolution to revise the student assignment policy and had sponsored the October 2010 resolution halting work on the zone plan.

“This is not a rush to vote in a plan," Goldman said. "This has been as solid two years in the making, not to mention all the discussions in this county for years prior to that.”

School board member Keith Sutton said he agreed that the plan hadn't been rushed. But he suggested delaying the vote by 30 days to build a bigger consensus and to have the current and new board members involved in the plan.

Sutton's "friendly amendment" for the 30-day delay wasn't accepted by board vice chairman John Tedesco, who had introduced the resolution.

School board member Deborah Prickett said Tata should be commended for bringing forward "a totally family-friendly assignment plan."

School board member Chris Malone said it was time to move the process along.

“People were calling me and saying, ‘Will you please get on with this. Please pass it. It looks good. We like what it’s doing,'" Malone said. "I can’t think of a better time to move forward and go on to other things like student achievement and whatever else we can find ourselves doing.”

Tedesco said that while the plan wouldn't satisfy everyone, it would deal with the "most pressing issue in our community: growth."

“It is time that we come together as a community, work together to make sure this plant is implemented with fidelity and success on behalf of all of our children in all of our schools and begin anew again to ensure that this works for the good of Wake County," Tedesco said.

After the plan was passed, school board chairman Ron Margiotta gave his speech.

"While the plan isn’t perfect, it is a major improvement, a huge step in the right direction," Margiotta said. "Node assignments are gone. There will no longer be assignments based on one’s socioeconomic status or race. In fact, students won’t be moved for any reason.  

Parents’ cries for stability and sensible options have been answered. This plan empowers them with their choice in their child’s education and students will be guaranteed long-term stability in assignment with predictable feeder patterns. It’s a new day in Wake County, one that I've looked forward to for a long time.”

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Total control

Ok, I admit what dragged me into this whole WCPSS quagmire was the assignment issue. I had a big problem with the control vs freedom issue.

But what is much scarier, more suggestive of total tyrannical control is this whole math placement issue. Please go read the last thread called something like "Reviewing math placement... Etc" . It's almost off the list below.

This topic, IMHO, is the heart of the beast. This more than anything illustrates the total and biased control this system has had. Ironically it's been the demonized Republicans, especially John Tedesco who have erected a data-based solution for the most forgotten kids in this county. But there's been a 'new and improved' path just created weeks ago for 'handpicked students' (not data driven) . It's dandy if you're one of those for whom this new secret math track is the best thing ever. Great for you. But this story shows how subjective and fragile the paths of the students in wcpss are. On the whim of an administrator- is that the way we want wake kids placed? Holy cow. This is deep. And important. I hope you'll all go read the threads on math placement.

Bobsconce you're mentioned by name so don't miss it.

A quick Google search shows

A quick Google search shows that Zonderman is not a K-12 public school teacher, but rather a part of the university system.  Zonderman is a Professor and Associate Department Head in History at North Carolina State University.

2 years does not equal quality

i see lots of posts that this has not been rushed since it took 2 years.  Unfortunately that does not equate to a quality plan.  there are too many open questions.  This plan was rushed for political reasons to support a political agenda and there are too many secrets about the plan.  Now the childrem will suffer.

Point of clarification: We

Point of clarification: We have been TALKING about student assignment for 2+ years. However, THIS particular student assignment plan has only been on the table for about SEVEN MONTHS and, in case no one has noticed, many pieces of it have been moving targets. But it's a done deal now, so -- time to move on.

Only time will tell if we

Only time will tell if we move on. I have a feeling the assignment plan will become an issue sometime after the new board members are sworn in.

"David Zonderman said that

"David Zonderman said that as a history teacher he had to give his history lesson about how the "narrow board majority staged a parliamentary coup de tat in 2009" and "dismantled a nationally recognized assignment."

DPI are you watching?  You have a name. Is this part of the curriculum?

You sir are the very reason that reasonable level headed adults are removing their children and fleeing the public school system. You have no business anywhere near the property of any school with your radical left-wing ideology and a venue to ram such ideas down the throats of unsuspecting children. Its a no wonder you see the chaos on Wall street. I am pretty much guessing they are all products of, well, teachers like you.

Nobody knows what the plan really is

The funny thing about the plan is that nobody what to call it.   Half the time it is the choice plan and half the time they call it the neighborhood school plan.   I would say that it is neither, it is a frankenstein.    Even key points like "Families who have a child moving from elementary to middle or middle to high can stay within the newly approved feeder pattern of their child's existing school."   are not as straight forward as they say as they split middle schools up so things are not as simple as they state.    For instance, a key feature is that parents can stay in existing feeder patterns which is what they have said to get the plan passed but that isn't even mentioned on the main page.   I expect there are going to be a lot more people moved to the new plan and not grandfathered in than was proposed when they really go to implement.     

If they had done a little more work and put some things in protecting a set of seats for achievement schools and answered more of the questions, they could have reached 100% of school board voting for it and fewer community questions.   Obviously after 2 years it was obvious this school board is not about getting everybody on board and they will be watching from their couch for the next 2 years.

It definitely....

is not a neighborhood plan. My schools are still the same (with the closest one not on the list available to me). While there are at least 5 elementary schools that are closer.

your node didn't complain loud enough

See, your node didn't complain loud enough in the chaos like other nodes did to get the school they have been pining away for under the old plan.    And the school system and board didn't release the final node to choice lists as part of the final plan so people couldn't complain any more.   Very calculated what they did to get the plan passed.    For those in a position of influence and power, the new plan is essentially a neighborhood plan as the list of choice schools are all the closest ones.   

(Add the capping and # of seats and the algorithm for getting 1st,2nd, 3rd, it becomes even less of a neighborhood plan).

...

I expect there are going to be a lot more people moved to the new plan and not grandfathered in than was proposed...

How so? Please explain.

So the theory of the plan is

So the theory of the plan is that:

* Current students can stay in their school and feeder pattern thru graduation

* New students (starting K) and those moving to new plan by choice get to stay thru graduation on existing feeder pattern

* New elementary, middle, and high schools are going to open which means that ES->MS and MS->HS feeder patterns will have to change from what they are now to new ones

* New elementary, middle, and high schools are going to open which is going to change the choice selections for nodes

What this means is that you have all this stability but only an upfront expection of a few new buses but if you look at it, for the next 12 years you have to deal with the old plan grandfathered students and then for every year in the new plan you have 12 years of grandfathered students due to the need for stability.   This means that for areas of growth where nodes have new options and feeder patterns change you are going to have an increasing amount of diversity which is going to drive huge transportation costs and complexity.     Additionally, you are going to have to fill schools that open in more than a hope of parent choosing (which we already know from their numbers that most parents, 94% want to stay where they are) and remember you can't force new feeder patterns so you still have to cross fingers that building a school at K, 6, or 9th grade that parents choose to get off their old feeder pattern to the new one.

So combining the need to fill schools efficiently and cost effectively and the huge burden of transportation, something is going to have to give down the road.   Take that into consideration with a new school board every 2 years, there are going to have to be decisions that decrease stability and force people into the plan.    I believe that at some point feeder patterns when they change are going to be forced on people so if you have one feeder pattern entering in K and in 3rd grade the feeder pattern changes to a new MS, you will be required to go to the new middle school to balance schools and growth.  Additionally, you will see transportation as as stick used by taking away guaranteed transportation as we know it today (maybe none or express only) that will force financially or logisitically stuck parents to get into the new plan by default to get local busing (pick up in neighborhood). 

In all the plans and simulations, I never saw any of thoughts of how the plan impacts the school system 3,5,7,12,20 years out discussed in any detail or how the applied the modeling to financial impacts.     As a tax payer, how can I in good mind give the schools more money via bond issues/taxes if they can't explain how their plan they have been working on for 2 years allows them to run efficiently over time.  

(I grant you that infill to nodes is handled by the new plan in a bit better way by capping schools but you still have transportation costs and issues there and you don't necessarily fix feeder pattern capacity problems).

I also believe that in the next 5 years that the school board is going to significantly change the plan from a frankenstein neighborhood/choice plan to a more neighborhood plan as there is still a large portion of neighborhood supporters that didn't get anything near what they wanted and will resurge.   But this future thoughts is another topic.

...

So your fear is that future Boards will force people into the plan and create instability?

From what I understand, as new schools are built, they are added to the feeder patterns. They aren't just left out there - hoping someone will choose it. It becomes a neighborhood school that students from certain middle schools will feed into.

The only 'forcing' that could happen is if Hill is re-elected. That's a whole different discussion.

Yes, new feeder patterns but

Yes, new feeder patterns but part of the plan also includes stability and knowing feeder patterns when starting K.   The new wording on the site seems to indicate that feeder patterns may not be guaranteed for MS and HS at the time of entering K so it goes back on some of the stability they started with.   It is very ambigious in the plan versus some of the statements on the site exactly when feeder patterns are guaranteed.   Is it the pattern when student enters K or do they get the feeder pattern at the time when it is time to enter 6th or 9th.  

I have been watching the terminology of the plan change and the statements change that seem to change slightly which changes the meaning.

So where is the truth? I

So where is the truth?

I have read that transportation will not be guaranteed to students who grandfather once the leave their current grade span. 

If what you say is true, and some middle schools have their feeder pattern changed when Rolesville HS opens, the kids at those middle schools will have to be driven to their current target HS or go to RHS.  Is that stability?  Is that not reassignment?  Will they not feel forced?

Other than the under-construction Rolesville MS, there aren't any middle schools up there that are closer to Rolesville HS than at least one other HS.  Do you think the parents at those schools are going to be thrilled when they are switched?  Is that going to create warm, fuzzy feeling?

Question

Dan are you planning to relocate from Southern Wake to the Wake Forest/Rolesville area? You seem to have a lot of concerns about the schools in Northern Wake County.

I would think the families up here can be an advocate for themselves and the families in other areas can also do the same.

Nope...if I move, it will be

Nope...if I move, it will be out of Wake County.

Rolesville HS is, as far as I know, the next HS that will open in Wake County.  That means that it will be the first time the situation comes up where feeder patterns will be changed.  They aren't opening ES, MS, and HS to create a totally new feeder system, so some will be changed.  When they are changed, it will go against some of the promises that have been made during the passage of the plan.

There are promises to not

There are promises to not change feeder patterns when new schools are opened?

promises and words and

promises and words and statements mean nothing unless it is spelled out in language of the plan.   Of course that can be changed but at least it has to be changed in a formal way.   All the talk and promises and even the assignment web site have changed the terminology every time they mentioned stability and what is guaranteed.   I see no actual wording in the 87 page assignment proposal that guarantees anything with regard to feeder plans other than some vague statements of a guaranteed feeder pattern.  But guaranteed when it doesn't explicitly spell it out...maybe i missed it.

From what I understand,

From what I understand, transportation for grandfathered students is only guaranteed at their current school.  Once they switch from ES to MS, or MS to HS, they would have to go to the feeder school for their address or provide their own ride to the feeder for their school.

I totally agree that transportation methods will be used to direct families toward a certain set of choices.  We'll be told how it had to be done, it's a great plan, etc., even though it's not one bit different than giving people less desirable traditional options to get them to stay at a YR school.

It is an unfortunate as a

It is an unfortunate as a true choice plan would be choice for all parents, not ones that can logistically or financial deal with the carrot and stick that the school system is going to use.   I would like some real honesty when they are going to use choice lists and feeder pattern and guaranteed transportation as levers to force people where they want to go.

It is unfortunate that some people will have different levels of opportunity of choice in the new plan based on these mechanisms and that the real truths of what will happen 5 years down the road under the plan with very clear explanations of various scenarios.   The scenarios they describe in presentations never include the clear and simple articulation of exactly what they will do.

The transportation for

The transportation for grandfathered students who want to keep their current feeder pattern will depend on whether the remaining schools beyond the one they're now at are among the choices they would get on their choice list. If they are, it's more likely they'll keep bus service all the way through. If it's not on the list then they're probably going to be without a bus.

A plan that is suppose to

A plan that is suppose to address growth shouldn't play in the grey areas of "more likely" and should address the black and white of yes or no.    If they can't guarantee it, then say busing is not going to be guaranteed period for grandfathered students except by some specified exception policy and then spell out the rules of that policy.  

The amount of grey areas left by the plan is the biggest problem and to me the grey areas have been left that way on purpose.

Coup de tat?

I realize foreign languages are considered optional these days but surely a writer knows it is coup d'etat?

 

As for the comment itself, how on earth can he describe it in those terms?  If the new board changes things again, will that amount to another coup d'etat?  Of course it won't.  I am just a wee bit concerned that Mr Zonderman is teaching the youth in this county.

In answer to your snide

In answer to your snide grammar police remark, I will point out that I wrote the blog post at 1 a.m. I have made the fix.

Margiotta: "In fact, students won’t be moved for any reason."

Well, that is not true. Students will be moved due to overcrowding (GROWTH).

Just look at Holly Springs HS. In a couple of years when the new high school is built, there will be plenty of children moved to it. What will be the criteria for doing so?

The plan has no

The plan has no reassignment. They will only fill new schools with people who request them. They're not supposed to fill existing schools above their capacity now. With the gradnfathering component it could be trickier in the next few years.

They have students in trailers...

They will have to move students out of the trailers. So, if no one asks to move to the new school, then they will have to force a move. Yes?

Unless you think they're

Unless you think they're lying, they say that no one will be required to leave their current school next year.  The tricky part looks like they'll have to limit rising kindergartners, 6th graders and ninth-graders from getting in bring the enrollment down to reduce crowding at some schools.

Everybody is grandfathered

Everybody is grandfathered in to their feeder pattern when the start at K and schools are capped due to growth.    The grandfathered component is not only a problem now but forever because of the stability it says it brings with setting up patterns.  "Each school will be part of a defined feeder pattern that will provide students with a predictable, stable path through 12th grade".

I agree that they would cause too much noise if they reassigned and one of the biggest problems of old plan of reassignment out of school mid-span but I also don't believe that forced assignment to new feeder patterns won't happen either to fill schools.   I don't think the level of worst case and actual planning has happened with regard to growth and new school opening.    Crossing fingers hoping people pick new schools isn't going to work.

...

Have you even read the plan?

See scenario above.

See my scenario above. When theory meets reality, reality usually wins.

Sounds like you did..

why don't you just answer the question? Would save him some time. And help others.

why don't you just answer

why don't you just answer the question? Would save him some time. And help others.

If you or anyone else can't answer that question, then you've been living in a cave. And for the cave dwellers, you CANNOT be reassigned out of school once you are in it.

...

LOL. All these questions and no one has read the plan.

Carry on complaining.

definetly was rushed

There are way too many open questions.  Just look at Brassfield --- that decision was not completely thought through.  There are too many open questions and many children at Brassfield that are negatively impacted by this plan.  Where is the stability, proximity, and fairness for our children????

How many years makes it not rushed?

I'm so sick of hearing the whining that "this plan was rushed."

This county has spent how many years fighting for the change that has now happened? At a minimum it's been two years, but the reality number says it's been more like two decades.

Either way, that doesn't qualify as rushed on any level.

Serioulsy...

Just because 2 years was spent on it....that does not mean that it is a quality plan!  There are too many open questions.  As a parent of one of the 15% that was significantly negatively impacted by this plan I can tell you that the plan is not solid.  By the way how could we even consider voting for a plan when we do not even know the full cost of the plan???

I never said it is quality

It is far from it. As for the costs, doesn't matter. We now have this plan and it is what it is. That is until Susan and Reverend Bobble take over the board in less than 60 days.

As I told you earlier, and I am still totally serious, the ONLY way you will kick this crap to the curb is to leave. Up and go. Be done with it.

I would spend my time and energy moving in that direction and wouldn't waste another moment stressing over what Kevin Hill hasn't done for you. One thing is certain, he won't do anything for you going forward if you and your neighbors allow him to be elected again.

...

You will continue to be ignored unless you get a Board rep that wants to work with your community. I can attest to the fact how important it is to have an involved Board rep who is engaged in the community.

Even Carol Parker, the previous D3 Board rep, believed the Board did the right thing by approving it and moving forward. No one wants to go back except Kevin Hill -- who, may I remind you, has done nothing for you.

http://www.newsobserver.com/2011/10/19/1578104/get-plan-approved.html

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About the blogger

T. Keung Hui covers Wake schools.
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