Northwest Raleigh could get a new elementary school at some point.
The school board voted Tuesday to pay $2,471,700 for 29.96 acres on the northern side of Shooting Club Road and on the western side of Creedmoor Road (NC 50). Click here for info on the parcel.
No opening date is set. Funding would come from the next school construction bond issue or some other means.
School board member Patti Head said that the district had been looking for affordable land in that area for several years.
Head said the new site replaces an elementary school that had been slated to be built on Leesville Church Road. Wake plans to build a middle school there now instead. That middle school is also waiting on the next bond isssue.
The vote was 6-2 with Beverley Clark and Ron Margiotta voting no.
Clark wanted to reevaluate the school district's capital program in light of the changing economic conditions.
Margiotta questioned the $82,500 per acre cost, thinking it could be gotten for a cheaper price.
But Head said the land was within the school district's budget. She argued that it would cost even more money to buy land in northwest Raleigh that had water and sewer.
Now it's up to the county commissioners to decide whether to fund the purchase.
Comments
elementary school
Wed, 10/28/2009 - 19:22 — mikejohnthanks for the information
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Count on a bond?
Thu, 01/08/2009 - 00:41 — g88ky07They certainly better not count on a bond for anything in the near future because I just don't see the next one passing!
With the 25,000+ they are about to add to the "let's alienate every _amn voter/parent we can and wonder why we can't get the support we need anymore" non-supporters list, they'll be lucky to pass bonds, even with Ann Goodynight spewing her wad, for years to come!
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.....................................................
Efficiency
Wed, 01/07/2009 - 23:52 — SDR256A speaker at the Apex HS BoE meeting made a compelling observation. He stated that Green Hope Elementary is a building with a footprint of 2 acres sitting on 70 acres. He suggested that this could be enough land for two other schools, a middle and a high school for instance. Now, of course there would be sacrifices - parking lots and playing fields. It was an interesting suggestion.
Although schools without all the peripheral bells and whistles might not appeal to some, it could make sense if its decided that we firmly want to put our goals on the side of education and efficiency. At some point we ARE going to have to choose what is most important for schools to do. I always thought it was education, but that's just me.
Kmisegades
Wed, 01/07/2009 - 17:55 — JSCWell, 432 students is fewer than even the smallest elementary school in the Wake system. Your academy doesn't provide transportion, so that eliminates the need for bus lots and parking. Kids eat lunch in the classroom, so there is no need for a cafeteria. I don't know if your academy offers P.E., or team sports, but if not, I'm guessing you don't have playing fields, or a gymnasium. How about performing arts...does your academy have an auditorium? I'm the first to say, sure - let's scrutiize construction costs, and reduce waste and redundancy, but your comparison doesn't wash.
Thales Academy Costs
Thu, 01/08/2009 - 10:05 — kmisegadesI was being kind to WCPSS.
Ron Margiotta, Wake BOE, provided me with the following numbers a year ago, for a nominal Wake government EL school:
Land use: 25 acres
Cost of school (excludes land cost): $20m
Number of students: 600
Time to build: 2 years
Here are the figures for the new Thales Academy - Apex
Land use: < 4 acres
Cost of school (excludes land cost): $3.2m
Number of stiudents: 432
Time to build: 8-9 months
Thales school saves money in a number of ways:
1. no cafeteria - kids eat in the classrooms.Same as my public EL school in Los Angeles in the early 1960s.
2. no transportation - many kids in public schools ride in the family van/SUV to school anyway. Many Thales children will be able to walk or ride a bike to school - just as all children of my generation did ('57), one reason we were healthier and ready to learn each morning.
3. no vast athletic facility - Thales uses the same philiosophy as the rest of the world - sports are for after-school, private or community clubs to provide. Schools should focus on academics, period. Other countries do quite well in Olympic and professional sports despite not having any in schools. (I spent 10 yeas in Europe, my kids attended German schools with no sporting facilities, worked great.) We do however have a nice playground and the kids will actually use it. Thales has a real P.E. teacher, which is not always the case in Wake government schools.
4. no expensive, rarely-used theater - although Thales does have a large downstair multi-purpose room for the school's after-school drama club
5. use of pre-engineered building and other cost-saving techniques used by commercial builders. All Thales schools are identical but beautiful inside and out.
6. 2 stories - children are perfectly capable of walking up and down stairs. An elevator is also in the school.
Direct Instruction, discipline, parental involvement, no tenure for highly-qualified professional teachers (who are paid more than in WCPSS schools), Iowa tests instead of laughable ABCs tests - these are some of the other aspects that set Thales apart.
As a result, Thales can not only be built for less then 25% the cost of WCPSS schools, but their annual tuition of $5,000 is about half what is spent in tax dollars annually for each child in Wake government schools (excluding capital costs for land acquisition and new building construction).
If your idea of public schools however is a place for children to become athletes or musicians or actors, then Thales is not for you. If you want them to obtain a world-class education in math, science, reading, writing, foreign languages, computer skills and more, then it is.
Come see for yourself. Thales Acacdemy-Apex holds its first public open house on Thursday, Jaunary 15th from 6-7PM. See www.thalesacademy.org for details.
Kent Misegades, Chairman, Board of Trustees, Thales Apex
Amen
Thu, 01/08/2009 - 13:03 — fiestamomSounds like Thales puts (cough cough) education first!!
Building costs
Thu, 01/08/2009 - 08:37 — fiestamomHere's one example from yesterday's Chicago Tribune on why schools cost so much: "Chicago Schools espresso machines a waste of money"- http://preview.tinyurl.com/9qk5c8
The Chicago schools spent $70K on espresso machines. I'm sure that waste (maybe not on that scale) goes on in WCPSS as well.
One reason the private sector does things cheaper is b/c of accountability, a private entity is going to closely look at money being spent because it's private money not 'government' money. Most government bidding systems give higher priority to minority owned business, even though the costs may be higher.
Changing the subject a little: why don't more schools build up? Wouldn't that reduce the schools footprint if they had a multi-storied school?
Tsk tsk
Thu, 01/08/2009 - 09:21 — Dadof3FM, let me update you on our new priorities.
$70 k on espresso machines wasn't a waste, it was an infrastructural enhancement.
The ravishing has only just begun. One trillion more opportunities to go.
What about a middle school?
Wed, 01/07/2009 - 12:39 — midtownmomDoes anyone know the amount of acreage needed for a middle school? It seems to be the greatest need at this point, even if we could redo the plans to fit the land. I really can't imagine what they're thinking right now, spending money on another elementary at this point when the upper grades are much more of a necessity right now.
Thales Academy includes middle school
Thu, 01/08/2009 - 10:23 — kmisegadesOur new Thales Academies are for grades K-8. Combines EL and MS. See cost breakdown for Thales-Apex above. Visit the school and see for yourself. First Open House is Thursday, January 15th, 6-7PM, www.thalesacademy.org
f. For capital planning
Wed, 01/07/2009 - 12:51 — AngelaWf. For capital planning purposes, property acquisition will be based on average acreage
requirement of 19 acres for elementary, 31 acres for middle, and 65 acres for high.
http://www.wcpss.net/growth/long-range_planning/planning_issues92105.pdf
Wake usually goes for at
Wed, 01/07/2009 - 12:47 — KeungHui (author)Wake usually goes for at least 40 acres for a middle school. The new one they're going to build on Leesville Church Road is smaller than that so it won't have an outdoor track.
Have they planned to build a middle on that site??
Wed, 01/07/2009 - 14:22 — midtownmomI had no idea they were going to build a middle school - I've always heard that it was too small and they might consider a sixth or ninth grade center as a temporary gap. So has this school been funded and when could it be ready? Also, is it for sure it would open as a year round, or could it be a traditional?
slated to be a "smaller
Wed, 01/07/2009 - 14:37 — AngelaWslated to be a "smaller scale" YR middle, TOTALLY contingent on funding from the next bond, whenever that may be. (and good luck getting that bond approved)
WCPSS owns the land only, correct Mr. Hui?
Wake owns the land. The road
Wed, 01/07/2009 - 14:50 — KeungHui (author)Wake owns the land. The road block is funding construction.
Thanks! was pretty sure
Wed, 01/07/2009 - 14:52 — AngelaWThanks! was pretty sure that was what I remembered.
How do they spend so much money on schools?
Wed, 01/07/2009 - 11:40 — kmisegadesThat's $83,000 / acre. Sure must have made that land owner happy. Our tax dollars at work once again.
Our new Thales Academy in Apex was built for $3.2m, total cost of the land (donated by a developer) and a beautiful building housing 432 students K-8. Less than four acres was required. How DOES WCPSS manage to spend 400% more to build schools? Are they gold-plated?
The first public open house for Thales Apex will be on Thursday, January 15th, 6-7PM.
www.thalesacademy.org
please clarify
Wed, 01/07/2009 - 22:35 — cgnolteCan you explain how you arrive at the 400% more figure? If you're just comparing land costs, obviously any price WCPSS pays is an infinite percentage increase over getting it for free. If you're comparing the total cost of the school, then what figure are you using for the constructed school? (I didn't see an estimate of that in the article.)
Thales -vs- Wake Costs
Thu, 01/08/2009 - 09:59 — kmisegadesI was being kind to WCPSS. Ron Margiottam Wake BOE, provided me with the following numbers a year ago, for a nominal Wake government EL school:
Land use: 25 acres
Cost of school (excludes land cost): $20m
Number of students: 600
Time to build: 2 years
Here are the figures for the new Thales Academy - Apex
Land use: < 4 acres
Cost of school (excludes land cost): $3.2m
Number of stiudents: 432
Time to build: 8-9 months
Thales school saves money in a number of ways:
1. no cafeteria - kids eat in the classrooms.
2. no transportation - many kids in public schools ride in the family van/SUV to school anyway. Many Thales children will be able to walk or ride a bike to school - just as all children of my generation did ('57), one reason we were healthier and ready to learn each morning.
3. no vast athletic facility - Thales uses the same philiosophy as the rest of the world - sports are for after-school, private or community clubs to provide. Schools should focus on academics, period. Other countries do quite well in Olympic and professional sports despite not having any in schools. (I spent 10 yeas in Europe, my kids attended German schools with no sporting facilities, worked great.) We do however have a nice playground and the kids will actually use it. Thales has a real P.E. teacher, which is not always the case in Wake government schools.
4. no expensive, rarely-used theater - although Thales does have a large downstair multi-purpose room for the school's after-school drama club
5. use of pre-engineered building and other cost-saving techniques used by commercial builders. All Thales schools are identical but beautiful inside and out.
6. 2 stories - children are perfectly capable of walking up and down stairs. An elevator is also in the school.
6. Direct Instruction, discipline, parental involvement, no tenure for highly-qualified professional teachers (who are paid more than in WCPSS schools), Iowa tests instead of laughable ABCs tests - these are some of the other aspects that set Thales apart.
As a result, Thales can not only be built for less then 25% the cost of WCPSS schools, but their annual tuition of $5,000 is about half what is spent in tax dollars annually for each child in Wake government schools (excluding capital costs for land acquisition and new building construction).
If your idea of public schools however is a place for children to become athletes or musicians or actors, then Thales is not for you. If you want them to obtain a world-class education in math, science, reading, writing, foreign languages, computer skills and more, then it is.
Thales Acacdemy-Apex holds its first public open house on Thursday, Jaunary 15th from 6-7PM. See www.thalesacademy.org for details.
Kent Misegades, Chairman, Board of Trustees, Thales Apex
not that Wake is bathing in
Fri, 01/09/2009 - 01:04 — vsheehannot that Wake is bathing in them but how many OTs, ST, Special Ed proffesionals, and reading specialists?
New Elementary School
Wed, 01/07/2009 - 10:33 — JAHI just read that there is land now set aside for a new elementary school at Creedmoor Road and Shooting Club road. Shouldn't this be a high school? As I understand it, the elementary schools in the area are underutilized, and the high schools are bursting at the seams.