The results of the Wake County school calendar survey are now online.
Per school board member Deborah Prickett's request, every school's response is listed even if the response rate was below 33 percent.
Click here for the link to the results.
UPDATE
Couple of interesting quick hits. With a 61 percent response rate at Leesville Elementary, 63 percent said they'd prefer year-round. With a 39 percent response rate at Leesville Middle. 60 percent prefer traditional.
With a 44 percent response rate at Wakefield Elementary, 57 percent preferred traditional.
Aside from Leesville Middle and Wakefield Elementary, Salem Middle was the only other school where you had at least a plurality of parents who responded who backed a calendar change. With a 52 percent response rate, 56 percent at Salem Middle said they want to go back to a traditional calendar.
Asst. Supt. David Holdkzom said that between now and March 2 they will examine the data and provide the board a breakdown at each school for results by application and base students.
Comments
Salem MS conversion?
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 13:31 — DrActualFactualGiven that Baucom ES converted from YR back to traditional and that heavily populated area (Haddon Hall subd. and vicinity) feed into Salem MS then up to Apex HS I am not surprised that people don't like a Traditional ES/MYR Middle/Traditional HS scenario and the 3-year time span of YR MS complicates the differing calendar issues if you have older or younger siblings on traditional. Now that the new board will allow parents to opt-out easily I think Apex MS and Davis Dr MS will be more crowded if Salem MS is not converted back to traditional. Also, the 3-yr. reassignment plan to populate Mills Park MS was going to pull hundreds of students from Salem MS to open that school . It will be interesting to see if Mills Park opens as YR or traditional. I think the 3-year plan was also intending to bus kids in from Raleigh and if the preference in those subdivisions is for traditional GM might want to seriously consider converting Salem MS back to traditional.
But
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 22:03 — local23Mills Park MS is pulling a huge number from Salem MS this coming year. I would think since Salem is already operating on a MS and has Davis on TR (schools are very close together), then let Mills Park be the TR for our area, it's brand new and so needed - schools that are suppose to feed in is Mills Park ES, Alston ES, Cedar Fork ES, Highcroft, Morrisville ES - Should also be Carpenter, along with the nodes from SE Raleigh & Garner
So Has Anyone Yet Tallied
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 21:22 — chaboardhow many YR schools had a majority (of respondents) prefer traditional, and vice-versa?
At a first glance at their
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 00:28 — DrActualFactualAt a first glance at their presentation what stood out to me was that there were 20,850 YR respondents (majority) and 17,936 traditional respondents and 800 modified; and yet the answer to the questions "Between these two types of calendars which do you prefer for this child?" the result was 49.80% for traditional and 44.75 for YR and 6.17% no preferance. I could be wrong but to me that seems there must be base students at YR that want to opt-out for traditional. Also, with regard to the survey question "If you had a sibling assigned to a different calendar or track school 46.58% would NOT prefer that calendar." I'm not sure the survey tells us as much as we hoped it would. It will be interesting to see which if any schools get converted back to traditional, after Mr. Neter's financial report if there are savings to be recouped in doing so, the sooner the conversions the better. Sounds like the district could use the money for operating funds.
Three year-round schools –
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 21:37 — AngelaWThree year-round schools – Leesville Middle, Salem Middle and Wakefield Elementary – had parents indicating they do not prefer year-round schools.
More than 61 percent of year-round parents indicated they were very satisfied with their child's school; 33.27 indicated they were satisfied. Parents with students at traditional calendar schools had similar results – 55.8 percent– indicated they were very satisfied. About 38 percent were satisfied.
Nearly 49 percent of respondents said they preferred traditional schools; 44.75 preferred year-round schools. Of parents with students enrolled in traditional calendar schools, 77.34 percent indicated they preferred traditional. Nearly 71 percent of year-round parents favored year-round schools.
What about the New MS Openings
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 10:05 — local23I truly wish the BOE realize they never asked questions about the new openings of MS - especially Mills Park MS. I realize that allot of ES parents actually do prefer YR as it's their mostly local school, but when comparing the survey responses for Mills Park ES - 50.95% perfer YR and 43.13% perfer TR - not that much difference, but if you would have asked the Mills Park ES (or other ES YR) raising 5th graders what do you perfer for MS, I am positive their response would be TR. That is one questions I really wished they would have asked for the new opening of MS. If they open Mills Park on YR, then there really will be no MS schools in our area on a TR- that is sad, because when kids start to grow up and get into HS, most parents will prefer the TR.
Positive huh?
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 10:18 — supportwcpssJust like you were positive about what the results of these surveys would be?
Pretty sure DDMS is traditional.
I am positive
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 22:08 — local23Positive that since most folks don't want to be realigned again, they still prefer their local YR..know the key is what groups responded and what tracks.
Also, another item to think about is grade level..rising 4th and 5th graders do not fit well into a YR MS, because of a multiude of reasons..i.e. after school activities, work (yes work, babysitting!), siblings, more resources are available for a TR schedule and the natural progression of HS.
It still goes down to a choice..many parents do prefer a TR close to their home as well as many parent prefer a YR close to their home!
Davis is not that close to us..Salem is actually easier to get to..we do not have a TR MS out here and what we all had been praying for over the last 8 years!
...
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 10:15 — SideburnsI agree, local. There is a lack of tradt'l MS seats in our area.
My child is currently in 5th grade. The survey showed that I was "satisfied" with her school assignment (she's a tradt'l applicant) and "satisifed" with her calendar (again, we applied for that seat). But, it does not show that I am "very dissatisfied" with her 6th grade school assigment and her 6th grade calendar (a YR school). The survey certainly doesn't show the whole picture.
Need to break it down a little more
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 00:01 — Solon77Preferences Trad YR
Elementary 42.6% 51.0%
Middle 53.0% 40.8%
High 73.0% 19.1%
Leesville Middle School - interesting 60% prefer Trad, 36% YR, however 71% responded as satisfied with the calendar and 85% satisfied with the assignment.
Bottom Line - YR gaining overall acceptance in a short period of time. Parents overwhelmingly satisfied where they are.
The issue is
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 08:39 — Voice_of_Reason_MANDITORY ! Parents should have a choice, YR doesn't work for everyone.
Thank You Angela
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 22:34 — chaboardSo were those three the only ones that "voted" against their current calendar? (ie, were there any traditionals that didn't prefer traditional or was it just the three YRs?)
those were the only three I
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 22:39 — AngelaWthose were the only three I specifically saw mentioned...
I was disappointed that
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 21:40 — jenmanI was disappointed that there wasn't a 'neutral' response for the questions. You had to pick a satisfield or dissatisfied answer. I'm neither for our elem school. I could take it or leave it.
Jenman you make a good point
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 08:33 — Voice_of_Reason_Angela's point that a supermajority in traditional schools prefer a normal schedule speaks volumes. A lot of parents also have adapted to the YR schedule and don't want to adapt again.
Wakefield ES results
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 20:41 — Voice_of_Reason_The results at WES don't include all the kids that were removed to private school because of the conversion. I know a lot of people who did. The survey wasn't open to them. Also remember, if you have only one child, YR school schedule is a usually a good thing.
True ...
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 22:40 — Bob_SconceThere's a survivor bias there. Hopefully the data analysis people will look at NCWISE ID numbers and match them up to nodes. The numbers don't include people who switched to the traditional calendar alternative.
And that brings up another interesting point... Rolesville ES is the traditional calendar alternative for WES. Yet, there are a bunch of people (including me) at Wakefield who didn't take that alternative. Why is that?
Bob agree
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 08:28 — Voice_of_Reason_If you are presented a school that has a worse track record as an alternative, it makes biting the bullet a bit easier, espially if the private option is not financially an option. I heard this year there were a lot of transfers to Thales Academy ($5K/yr) in Wake Forest from WES. That was mainly from parents who tried to ride out the transition the first couple of years.
I believe the single child (including year-apart) bias accounts for at least 25% of the "I like YR". We all have to remember that YR in the form that WCPSS uses does nothing positive for the child academically (at least that is what the research shows).
IMHO, If Wakefield ES is not reconverted, the new school board will not make good on their promise of no MYR.
Bob, I hate to say it since
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 23:30 — user12345Bob, I hate to say it since many have their hearts set on it ... but if anything seems unusual it would be the Wakefield ES and LSMS wanting Traditional which is different than most every other school ... we have been assuming there is something unique about these schools but could duplicate entries, miscount, etc. have tripped these schools to showing TR ... I only say that because they seem to be different than other places.
So...
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 08:49 — Bob_SconceWES is in a different position because it is SOO underused on the YR schedule -- search for "Wakefield" among the comments and they all say the same thing: running on 3 tracks, empty classrooms, both WMS and WHS on traditional schedules. PLUS, the school has been hit by the class size mandate -- on a year round schedule, that means forcing people into a different track mid-year. If anything, that's a recipe for fury at the YR calendar.
In addition, there are a lot of parents who are upset at the school, largely because it's a "School of Progress" when it used to be an "Honors School of Excellence." At VoR has pointed out, we've had a lot of exits for Thale. Many of the parents who remain are discontented with the whole situation.
As for LRMS, I think it's because they were just converted and haven't yet resigned themselves to being a year-round school. Plus, I would expect support for year-round to be lower among middle school families who generally lose more by not having a summer.
"support for year-round to
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 10:24 — AngelaW"support for year-round to be lower among middle school families who generally lose more by not having a summer."
or electives available on every track......just sayin'
and kids having to go to
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 17:22 — jenmanand kids having to go to school for sports and performances when they are tracked out.
same was true for
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 22:45 — AngelaWsame was true for LES...first year (07) we didn't "know" our "option"-- turned out to be Stough, late in the game, we begged for Hilburn (2.5 miles away), WCPSS waited until they turned it into a Title I school then "gave" it to us for our opt-out last year instead....
Survey Results
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 20:23 — RMC10Please guys analyze these results (Wake County Board - are ya lookin). These survey results are skewed (severely) - when you take 1300 results out of a survey it will skew the results - and that many duplications and wrong student ID numbers - I'm not confident in these removals - please someone ask to see these actual null results in paper form. And, what did I hear on WRAL's news tonight - how many staffers were included. These results look questionable. I work in internet marketing, and I'm saying the survey was challenging to complete. There was a jump point (depending on your answer), and I did not get to "see" many of these questions. The percents while equaling 100% (most of them), do not make logical sequencing percents for % of populations responding. Chuck and staff may be dissin' the citizens again - and were the staffers' results included in that number, because they should be a sidebar analysis not a report analysis. They were supposed to be a "normalizing" survey result not a "defining" report result. Define "staff" were there that many teachers that participating?
If it smells like fish - you gotta look for the scales used.
Plus you have to extrapolate the results out over the % responding, you cannot take it as a pure value - gotta add in the results or look at the percent removed comments. I volunteer to give an unbiased review of this data on a percent vs. population basis. Chuck I believe is wrong in his analysis - Board please don't take this at it's face value as presented. Look at your data collection points, your results and if "weighting" results was a factor.
Lisa B just spoke at the BOE
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 17:10 — shank56Lisa B just spoke at the BOE public hearing - very confidently - that in the event of calendar conversions at the LEesville schools, that Sycamore Creek East Cary, and Durant become the YR opt outs.
I agree. Confident is a
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 21:19 — changewcpssI agree. Confident is a good description. Probably confident because of her community support to keep their schools all traditional. Do those 3 schools she mentioned make sense as opt outs in terms of location and space for YR opt outs?
I guess one of the concerns
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 22:22 — NWRaleighMomI guess one of the concerns for parents that they wouldn't be able to get their preferred track. Maybe it makes sense to add a 'traditional' track into LRES. It was proposed two years ago but turned down by Patti Head.
The Leesville EL survey
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 22:12 — shank56her community support to keep their schools all traditional.
But the survey of the EL shows that the community support is overwhelming to keep LES as YR.
My understanding from
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 22:29 — changewcpssMy understanding from speaking to others is that she includes all schools in her neighborhood community as her inner circle. When you take into account the HS families at Leesville Road, all of the MS families who attend the Leesville Road HS and the ES families who attend the Leesville Road MS you have incredibly strong community support for changing those schools back to the same schedule. It is bigger than just her 3 schools. In that context, the survey results at that one school are miniscule, especially when they included responses from more than their base population.
If I remember correctly, she
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 21:44 — jenmanIf I remember correctly, she listed Brier Creek & Sycamore Crk as ES YR options and East Cary and Durant as MS options. I don't know about East Cary, but the other three are under capacity so they are definitely viable options.
Rather than whine and accuse
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 21:59 — changewcpssRather than whine and accuse she has always offered common sense solutions. I especially appreciated her request to implore the BoE to offer grandfathering to all students in her school after switching it to traditional.
I agree. Even though Lisa
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 22:25 — jenmanI agree. Even though Lisa is fighting for what she believes is best for Leesville, she still thinks about others.
Really
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 00:39 — Solon77Do y'all actually look at any of the data ? You talk about reassigning kids to other schools as no big deal. Have you actually looked at the survey results, proximity and crowding factors at the schools you are so willing to assign other students and families to ? Leesvile Elementary is 63% to 31% favor to YR. Middle school is nearly the opposite, however 85% are satisfied with the current assignment. So help me to understand the justification to convert Leesville to a traditional calendar, I don't see the survey supporting it - what am I missing ?
What are you missing?
Wed, 02/03/2010 - 00:57 — g88ky07Maybe that the survey data won't be the only deciding factor in these decisions? We have major budget issues to tackle and if saving 20 cents can be done at under crowded YR's then that weighs as heavily, if not more, than survey results I'd say!
"Parents overwhelmingly satisfied where they are", you said. Is that because they don't want their lives disrupted again or complacency maybe? I'd say the results are pretty evenly matched when it's all totaled up.
Now that I've made the
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 22:36 — changewcpssNow that I've made the connection and saw you speak today I can say the same for you. Well said.
thanks! :-)
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 22:45 — jenmanthanks! :-)
I don't think there are
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 17:16 — NWRaleighMomI don't think there are going to be many opt-outs for LRMS.
That's what Ms. Prickett is
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 17:59 — ncellagatorThat's what Ms. Prickett is telling everyone.
Too bad we all can't have a
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 21:30 — changewcpssToo bad we all can't have a D Prickett in our corner. Whereas P Head was completely against her constituents, D Prickett has listened to them.
Majority want yr at LRES but
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 17:07 — YRLRESMajority want yr at LRES but there are those still pushing for conversion. Wow. They claim they are against disruption. They claim they want stability & continuity. Really? Interesting way of showing it. Are they interested in the schools and communities well-being? How about honoring the families, teachers & staff who clearly want YR and are the majority. And the majority has spoken. Parents spoke, teachers spoke let it go….move on or move out. For the record to make a fuss over the traditional vote at LRMS isn’t too impressive considering the number of surveys taken and LRMS’s population. I’m not convinced.
Middle School Traditional preference
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 17:03 — allkidsfirstI'm not at all surprised Middle School parents have a lower preference for Traditional.
- It's easier to take elementary kids out of school. Parents feel more confident that they can get their child brought up to speed with subject material. So it's much less of a problem to have an elementary child on a separate calendar.
- The opportunities for summer week-long overnight camps, sports camps, and youth group trips increase dramatically in middle school.
The Complacency runs rampant
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 18:19 — g88ky07that's obvious. Most parents don't want their lives disrupted, don't want to have to change their routine, don't want, don't want ... and I think that's clearly stated in much of the "survey results." I'm glad that 50% +/- of teachers & staff finally spoke up and had a means to do so w/o fear of losing their job.
I think it should be very concerning to those who commented, that their addresses, phone #'s etc.. have now been posted along with their comments. Should all those folks get free credit reports for a year? How much is that going to cost tax payers?
I was THRILLED to see the board, Mrs. Goldman especially, snuff out Chuck's attempt to ram through his implementation agenda this afternoon. His last attempt to stick to us before he quits and takes his dog & pony show elsewhere FAILED. Sorry Chucky, YOU LOST on that one!
Back to the survey results, sighhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh ... I wonder where will it go from here, especially since the budget news was so dire again today. Buckle up folks, I believe the ride is about to get really bumpy!
I was THRILLED to see the
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 18:25 — NWRaleighMomI was THRILLED to see the board, Mrs. Goldman especially, snuff out Chuck's attempt to ram through his implementation agenda this afternoon. His last attempt to stick to us before he quits and takes his dog & pony show elsewhere FAILED.
------------------------------------------
Please provide details. I am still working and can not watch it live.
Did Chuck
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 18:34 — g88ky07just come back up for a 2nd try at getting his way? Yes, I believe he did. And got defeated yet again! BAMM!
Chuck brother, your day is over, leave. NOW!
Mr. Hui, will you please explain what happened, I'm sure you can tell it more accurately than I. It happened so fast I'm dizzy! Maybe it wasn't as big a deal as I think, but he didn't get his way, of that I'm pretty sure.
I dealt with it in the post
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 21:17 — KeungHui (author)I dealt with it in the post about tabling the calendar node changes. Keith Sutton asked Dulaney to come back up because he said the board hadn't clearly given him direction on what to do with those nodes. Dulaney said he'd tell folks, if they're sent to a different one than the one listed in the application, that the motion had been tabled at the time of the application period.
"Dulaney said he'd tell
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 22:05 — Apexter"Dulaney said he'd tell folks, if they're sent to a different one than
the one listed in the application, that the motion had been tabled at
the time of the application period."
For years, the VYR magnet process was run with a caveat that you were applying to the Year Round PROGRAM, not the school. I don't see a huge difference with this. Presumably the parents WILL know the school at the time when they will choose whether or not to accept it. (And, as was noted earlier, a number have been known to apply to the YR magnet, and then drop it when they didn't like the track they were assigned.)
It appeared that Lisa B was
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 22:10 — changewcpssIt appeared that Lisa B was making suggestions that would allow parents from her community to know exactly which YR school they are applying to this month. IMO, applying to the YR program is different than applying to a specific school, and what she proposed made sense.
Brilliant. That was enough
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 20:59 — changewcpssBrilliant. That was enough to force me to close up my laptop and head on home. C Dulaney has been exposed and no one believes him anymore.
I think he was called back
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 19:31 — shank56I think he was called back up by someone on the BOE for questioning. He wanted clarification as to what their expectations were for him to proceed. Burns stated what he thought they wanted and all concurred. IIRC, the BOE will here all comments at the forums and review all survey info . No decisions on assignment will be made until March 2 or March 16 board meetings.
Just Wondering
Tue, 02/02/2010 - 16:29 — shank56How do Louise L and Lisa B explain these results?