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Monday debate: Justin Peters

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General manager Jim Rutherford made it official this past week: Justin Peters will be the Canes' No. 2 goalie next season.

Question: is Peters ready to be the No. 2 guy?

Goaltender Cam Ward is coming off the back injury and the Canes surely will look to cut back on his workload. Is Peters at 23 ready to step in and be a solid, reliable backup, or should the Canes have signed veteran Manny Legace as better insurance?

The floor is open.

 

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Goalie starts

Some of you people don't pay much attention do you?  Is Coach Maurice the only guy uses his starter that much?  No.  Every year there are 5 or 6 goalies getting 70 or more starts in a regular season.  The most Cam has played in a year was 69, which by the way was a Lavi coached season.  Hard to blame a coach for starting the goalie that gives your team the best chance of winning. 

Top Goalie games

Beer, you are so right.

Brodeur, Nabokov, Bryzgalov, Miller, Luongo, Quick, Anderson, Kiprisoff, Lundqvist.

These are the top goalies in the league is terms of wins.  They all played about 70 regular season games last year. Some more. When a team has a clear number one goalie, that is just the normal number if games they play. People can bash Mo about other things but he is just doing what most coaches do when it comes to goalie starts.

The secondary question that has now emerged is whether or not Cam is an unusual case because of his back. In my opinion I would start the season with the plan on not starting him more than 60 regular season games.  If he stays strong you can then always ride him in the playoffs.

Brodeur - lost in Round 1

Brodeur - lost in Round 1

Nabokov - lost in Round 3 (a sweep)

Bryzgalov - lost in Round 1

Miller - lost in Round 1

Luongo - lost in Round 2

Quick - lost in Round 1

Anderson - lost in Round 1

Kiprusoff - didn't make playoffs

Lundqvist - didn't make playoffs

In other words, only 2 of these always-playing goalies made it past Round 1. I'm just saying.

Niemi and Leighton

And Niemi played 39 and Leighton 35 regular season games respectively. So well rested. Did that final series look like a goaltender's duel to you?
 

Brodeur-lost in round 1

All of the above mentioned goalies' teams lost to better teams. Flyers were a better TEAM than N.J., same with Chicago being better than San Jose, etc. The only exception might be Miller because Buffalo's lack of offense caught up to them.  Funny how in the 08-09 season when Cam played a lot of games and the team made the conference finals, this wasn't a concern.  Now it is, and that's solely due to his back issues. 

That's a tautology, right?

That's a tautology, right? My point was that there ain't nothin' magic about playing a goalie that much.

So everyone else does it...

... is it right?

I don't know.  

As Brodeur ages, he seems to run out of steam in the playoffs faster and faster.

Did Miller run out this year?

What two teams made it to the finals?  Two teams that were forced or chose to play multiple goalies during the season.   What worked for the Cane's in '06?  I fresh goalie in the playoffs.

Just because everyone speeds, smokes, etc., I'm not gonna do it.  Just because the other guys get played into the ground, does Mo have to do it?

For Goodness Sake

For goodness sake, then look over the past 20 years at all the great goalies..... they tended to start most games for their teams.  And in some years every playoff game on cup winning teams. And they had long careers.

The point is that this number of games thing is a red herring IF the goalie is healthy. Forwards and D often play every game and they are involved in heavy contact and exhaustive sprints on the ice.  If any of you have  played at a high level you should  know this whole number of game issue is simply not a factor amongst the players. And it should not be a factor in bashing Mo.

However if we now have a goalie with a back issues and you don't compensate by having a team massage therapist on your team, make sure he is loose after long flights and still play him the same number of games as a goalie without those issues, then I agree he not a very smart coach.  But stop saying that more than 60 games is too much across the board for all goaltenders.... it just doesn't hold water if you look at the past 20 years of the sport. Suggest you pose that question to Tom Barrassa the next time he is on a local talk show or at one of the player/coach fan lunches at the RBC.  He will tell you the same thing.

OK, sorry for my opinion

I'll just stop.  You're right, I have no cred.  I never played at a high level.

 

I just pay their salaries.  That doesn't allow me any opinion.

 

OUT.

Ok, sorry for my opinion

We all have out opinion about goalies and the number of games they play. If one examines the history of the game, teams had only one goalie for many, many years. Yes, they only played 44, then 60 games, but still it was just the one goalie. Part of the lore of the Stanley Cup occurred when the Rangers were in the finals and their goalie got hurt.  He was replaced by a team member not dressed for the game who was sitting in the stands. I think it was one of the Patrick's whose family owned the Rangers at the time. I think that sittler27 can bail me out on this one.  An elite goalie can handle 72 games a year and still perform well in the playoffs provided he's mentally rested.  Brodeur's downfall in the past few playoffs is due in large measure to the defense in front of him. They aren't what he's had in the past, and quite honestly they are an average group. Night in and night out, the goalie must be the best player on the ice. It is especially true when his team is on the penalty kill.  It is a mentally draining position and we all know that when we are mentally tired, it affects us physically as well.  Several posters have referred to the '06 Cup win and having two rested goalies.  Truth of the matter was that Gerber was the preferred goalie, but lost about 20 lbs. due to some kind of virus. That sapped his strength. We were fortunate to have a back up of Cam's mental poise.

Opinion

You are right. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. But I would also think that people would like to get the direct perspective from the front office and locker room.

Prior to the two major expansions you are also correct that teams tended to just have one prime goalie and it was rare for the backup to see any time.  Players were not as well conditioned as they are today but still managed to play all the games and the number one goalie might actually play every every game with the back up only getting time in cases of illness or spot work if a game was oui of hand.  Typically the number only came out of  games if he was having a bad night or if the coach wanted to give the back up spot work.

After expansion we started to see a schedule where some teams played 3 games in 4 nights. Even at that some of the iron horse goalies still wanted to play them all but you started seeing more and more 70 game/ 12 game splits with backups coming in more frequently when there were these lack of breaks and some coaches had quicker hooks when the number 1 wasn't on his game.  Today when you see even game splits between goalies or less than say 60 games it is because there are injury issues are there isn't a clear number 1. But the issue is not about fatigue and you would think that people would want to understand all the dynamics that go into these team and personnel decisions.

Sure we pay the player and manager salaries by buying tickets. But similarly, I'm a shareholder of Cisco and my firm buyers their servers. That doesn't mean I have a right to day to day directive input on their internal strategies or personnel decisions. Agree or disagree, JR has been in the business most of his life and he was an NHL goaltender. Mo was both a player and he is a real student of the game. And Barrasso is a Hall of Famer. These guys have the knowledge and they do have a strategy. And they are not going to ruin a critical franchise asset by "overplaying" him.  Going forward, if (and we don't know for sure that he does) Cam now has a chronic back issues , they will surely want to play Peters more to  make sure Cam doesn't play all the games in those tight stretches as well as making sure Peters is sharp in case of a recurrence of Cam's injury.

Sittler27 and give and take

Sittler27, if I had to pick one person's posts and that was the only person I could read at CanesNow, I would instantly select your posts.  I do think that one post might have been one that came across as having a little more of an ad hominum beatdown than you meant to convey.  The nature of CanesNow is that we all express our opinions - and the idea is that the diversity of experience will create a tapestry.  I happened to agree with the substance of your comments to wxray1, but it same across somewhat harsher than is your normal post.  I like reading what wxray1 has to say and prefer us all to express opinions without incurring hellfire raining down upon our heads - even if the opinions are not necessarily grounded in in-depth research. 

sittler27 and give and take

We as 'Canes fans and as hockey fans in  general are extremely fortunate to have a team and, as such, this forum to share our views with other fans.  Some we agree with, some we don't. With the exception for a few posters, and one in particular (I think we know who that is), everyone else is respectful of what others think and say. I know I enjoy reading what others have to say, and hope they enjoy what I have to say. Whether they agree or not is a moot point. I'm glad they all don't always agree with my postings, as I don't always agree with their point.  If we all agreed, then it would be way too boring. We all owe a debt of gratitude to the 'Canes for being here and for the N&O for providing us with the space to post our opinions.  

Point Taken

I re-read what and how I said it. Both of you are right. It did come across both as impatient and harsher than I intended. I apologize to anyone I offended and specifically to wxray.

No problem at all.  I

No problem at all.  I really like 99% of your posts.  Keep it going.  You've had great insights.  The board has really benefited from your posts.

I should have shaken it off instead of "stealing the game puck and throwing it in the garbage."  :-)

OT: Chris Pronger Puck

  I have so been waiting to post this.

Question:  How can you tell you can tell it's a Chris Pronger puck?

Answer:  No matter how hard you try, it won't shut the puck up.

No problem at all. I

Are you sure you threw the game puck in the garbage can?  They won't mysteriously show up on some on line auction site" he asked knowingly?" " Wink wink, nudge, nudge." Always time for a good Monty Python quote as well as something from Mel Brooks!

I was serious, I won't

I was serious, I won't comment anymore on this topic.  You told me to "stop", so I am.  I guess I took some offense to the slap down.  "... stop saying ..." (something I didn't exactly say).    It kinda squelches give and take, ya know?

That said, I've enjoyed reading everything else from you guys.  So I hope you don't stop.  Honest.

Peters is ready

Justin is ready for a backup role, and will only really be pushed and challenged enough to continue improving at the NHL level.  I'd like to see a mix of about 60/20 starts for Cam/Justin. 

percent

I think floydm11 was counting games and not percentages. Still, that leaves 2 games for Tripp.

:-)

:-)

Who plays the other 20%

You said 60/20 for Cam/Justin.  Does Tripp play the other 20?  :-)

 

I assume you meant 80/20, right?  That's my hope too, instead of the 95/5 Mo tends to do.

Only thing is...

that by making this announcement JR has effectively eliminated the ability to sign the kid to a two-way contract (which would have been nice "insurance" if he turned out to not be quite ready yet). But maybe it wasn't going to be relevant because if he's at the point that he has to clear waivers to go down, he probably would get claimed by another team anyway.

Goalies

If I had my choice, I would have liked to have seen Legace re-signed for one more year.  Here's the main reason why.  If Cam's back issues flare up, it would be easier to have Legace who's a proven NHL goalie step in and have Peters called up as the back up. Now if Cam goes down, Peters is the #1 and the team would have either Pogge or Murphy as the back up.  Pogge does have some NHL experience, but not for some time. With the possible issues on the defense, it puts more pressure on them not to make mistakes.  We've seen what Peters can do in a short stretch, but do we really know what he will be like if he has to play 6 or 7 games in a row? This is one way to fine out. It's all about the long term, not the short term.

If both Ward and Peters are

If both Ward and Peters are injured, JR can always pick up a goalie from the UFA market or trade for one. Who knows, Legace might not sign with anybody. JR wouldn't have to spend the $500K unless he really needs to.

This is a development year for the team, why not?

I was hoping JR would sign Manny for one more year.  But now that JR and PK have made it clear that the budgets are slashed, and we are going to see a lot of youngsters, then why not?  Might as well add Justin to the mix.

 

One thing's for certain.  This will be an interesting year.

Agree with the others...so far

I think Peters is ready and will make a great backup goalie.  My only concern is will he play enough!!  Wardo is definitely our #1 but Peters will push Cam to be his best.

It's all up to Mo and JR now.  Do the right thing fella's!  LET HIM PLAY!!!

I believe Peters is ready.

I believe Peters is ready, and JR/PK obviously didn't want to blow another $500K to keep Legace around. Question is, how much will Peters play -- unless Ward is hurt. 

My thoughts are

I think Petey will be a good back up, he will try and give Ward a run for his money, and Justin is smart enough to know that his time will come but if the canes keep jacking him around Justin will go looking else where especially if his numbers are good -to excellent.

Only time will tell huh ? Thanks Chip

 

 

The Canes are Good,My Grand kids are Better, and Life is Great !! Go Canes !!

The right choice...

I like the choice if, and this is a big if, Maurice will give him a chance to play. He's a good goaltender and he'll challenge Ward to be his best. Plus, we've got to pay the kid now that he's an RFA. Let's get our money's worth.

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About the blogger

A Raleigh native, Chip has worked at the N&O since 1979 and is the Canes beat writer. He can be reached at chip.alexander@newsobserver.com. You can follow him on Twitter at @ice_chip.
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